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Post by Jack on Feb 9, 2007 0:42:07 GMT -5
Do any of your religion's beliefs and/or practices bother you? I'm bugged by the Christian concept of predestination. Yankel mentioned the practice of stoning sinners described in Jewish scripture. Can you imagine people doing that to adulterers in 2007 America?
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Post by praetorian on Feb 9, 2007 8:29:32 GMT -5
Since I don't have any..no. If anyone is bothered by their religion they should forsake it then.
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Post by ndrthl on Feb 9, 2007 10:00:27 GMT -5
No, I am not religious. I am not bothered by religion either. The concept of an almighty and thoroughly benevolent God controlling such an unjust and non fair world we live in has always looked contradictory to me though. Religious ideas can sound very unreasonable. The Epicurean paradox: "The Epicurean paradox is a famous argument against the existence of an all-powerful and providential God. The paradox is quoted as this: God either wants to eliminate bad things and cannot, or can but does not want to, or neither wishes to nor can, or both wants to and can. If he wants to and cannot, he is weak -- and this does not apply to God. If he can but does not want to, then he is spiteful -- which is equally foreign to God's nature. If he neither wants to nor can, he is both weak and spiteful and so not a god. If he wants to and can, which is the only thing fitting for a god, where then do bad things come from? Or why does he not eliminate them?". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epicurus |
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Post by Funk Monk on Feb 9, 2007 10:37:15 GMT -5
Religious people are less intelligent than atheists, according to some Danish study.
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Post by atessalev on Feb 9, 2007 10:57:52 GMT -5
It's probably because because believing in God is illogical, and those who do lack knowledge and are thus less intelligent. Do you have a link to the study?
I have some trouble with some aspects of my beliefs, but i take it one step at a time. Studying it is important.
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Post by praetorian on Feb 9, 2007 11:06:37 GMT -5
I also remember a study which stated that people with high IQ are less likely to be religious.
The only way religion would make sense to me, would be if god where to be a software designer and the program is simply running. He doesn't care about the outcome, he is merely a spectator. By unlocking his software code one gets a bigger understanding of nature. For example why are the laws of physics the way they are? There's no answer to this. The answer could be "because they follow the programing codes", lol.
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Post by Funk Monk on Feb 9, 2007 13:01:33 GMT -5
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Post by Anodyne on Feb 9, 2007 16:17:55 GMT -5
I'm an atheist but when I was a kid, and I didn't know any better, I had a serious issue with hell. I had this constant fear I was going to hell. I thought demons were going to take me over. It was a very bad case of OCD. I didn't have a religious upbringing other than going to Catholic School, but the threat of a hell for anything I did wrong made me stress out. I think my OCD would have shown itself in another form, but, perhaps, it would have been less detrimental without the religious aspect.
Jack, as far as I know predestination is a Calvanist/Presbyterian concept. The solution would be to accept the Catholic Church with its funky pope, or become a Lutheran. Or form your own church. I think the latter is best.
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Post by Funk Monk on Feb 9, 2007 16:49:29 GMT -5
^ I had something similar, I imagined God as a wizard like old man who would just kill me (or prevent me from going to Heaven) if I didn't believe in him (I had dreams about being sucked into a black hole like thing while the Saruman god stood next to it).
My maternal family is very religious, and I even went to sunday school, so I always had a relationship to religion, though superficial as it didn't interest me at all, but had my moments of paranoia when I realised I didn't believe in God.
So I believed in God (or convinced myself that I could convince God that I did believe in him) just for the sake of believing in him, until I was ten or something, and had learned enough about animals, nature and evolution to find the idea of a "God" ridiculous.
Sounds crazy, but what can a child do when it's force-fed with nonsense?
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Post by praetorian on Feb 9, 2007 22:24:45 GMT -5
I don't remember ever believing in God. And I went to a Catholic school from ages 9 to 12. I guess it never made sense to me. My parents never talked about it either.
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Post by Mike the Jedi on Feb 9, 2007 22:39:36 GMT -5
My parents were never fundamentalist nor very churchy, yet I always remember believing in God. So no, it doesn't bother me. It's more often people who claim to practice it or do things in its name that get on my nerves. Those who think they are some sort of authority.
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Post by Jack on Feb 10, 2007 2:42:17 GMT -5
I'm an atheist but when I was a kid, and I didn't know any better, I had a serious issue with hell. I had this constant fear I was going to hell. I thought demons were going to take me over. It was a very bad case of OCD. I didn't have a religious upbringing other than going to Catholic School, but the threat of a hell for anything I did wrong made me stress out. I think my OCD would have shown itself in another form, but, perhaps, it would have been less detrimental without the religious aspect. Jack, as far as I know predestination is a Calvanist/Presbyterian concept. The solution would be to accept the Catholic Church with its funky pope, or become a Lutheran. Or form your own church. I think the latter is best. You're right, Anodyne. I extended the doctrine to the whole of Christianity because, logically, (though not always officially) that doctrine would apply to all Christians who believe in an omniscient deity. I'll leave it at that. BTW, religious obsessions and scrupulosity are very common in people who have OCD. They cut across all belief systems. The concept of Hell troubled me since I was in kindergarten, and I spent countless hours fearing that I would go there for any number of reasons. I almost became a "generic believer" because of it. |
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Post by Jack on Feb 10, 2007 6:15:44 GMT -5
Since I don't have any..no. If anyone is bothered by their religion they should forsake it then. I don't think that it should be forsaken. Maybe it just needs to be approached in a different way. |
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Post by Jack on Feb 10, 2007 6:19:54 GMT -5
No, I am not religious. I am not bothered by religion either. The concept of an almighty and thoroughly benevolent God controlling such an unjust and non fair world we live in has always looked contradictory to me though. Religious ideas can sound very unreasonable. The Epicurean paradox: "The Epicurean paradox is a famous argument against the existence of an all-powerful and providential God. The paradox is quoted as this: God either wants to eliminate bad things and cannot, or can but does not want to, or neither wishes to nor can, or both wants to and can. If he wants to and cannot, he is weak -- and this does not apply to God. If he can but does not want to, then he is spiteful -- which is equally foreign to God's nature. If he neither wants to nor can, he is both weak and spiteful and so not a god. If he wants to and can, which is the only thing fitting for a god, where then do bad things come from? Or why does he not eliminate them?". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EpicurusCould there be another choice? Is it possible that the Creator has chosen to not know certain outcomes? He can limit His omniscience due to His omnipotence. There's a certain logical and moral sense to this. |
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Post by Jack on Feb 10, 2007 6:33:32 GMT -5
Religious people are less intelligent than atheists, according to some Danish study. I've seen similar studies, and I'm not sure how accurate they are as real representations of people who have faith in a higher power of some kind. I think that there is a distinction to be made between fundamentalism and spirituality with the latter belief system representing the same kind of curiosity that leads many people to pursue the natural sciences. IOW, they discover the facts before they reach their conclusions. That's not to say that faith isn't the deciding factor in many cases. |
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